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combatshotgun

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Reply with quote  #1 
It is hard to sell products these days due to the cloning and fraud that is abundant on line.  E-bay is one of the worst places.   I have some Magpul flip up sights coming in and I will check out all the legitimate sites that sell them and beat their price.  However, what I am going to show below is the illegitimate clone product.   A seller on e-bays sells the rear sight well below dealer cost, he is selling them for almost 20% below dealer cost so even if he was a dealer he is loosing money.  However if you simply investigate a little you find out he is in China.  So do you want to believe a guy in China is buying a legitimate product made in America and selling it for less then an American dealer can even buy it for?  Here is the proof that this is a clone.  First the picture he is using then his location.  I cut and pasted it from the e-bay site and you can go there and see it also.   

So how is this happening.  Easy.  They buy the product and copy it.  That is why the Surefire 318 and 618's were discontinued. The 618FGA was being sold on e-bay for $178.  As a Surefire Professional Dealer my cost was the max discount from Surefire on all their products and my Dealer cost on that forend was $268 at the time the China knock off's were being sold on e-bay for $178.

Trump was the only one to address this and the hold up in his China Trade deal is getting them to stop this fraud.   No one else seems to care and American Companies are getting ripped off and the American people are helping by buying these frauds.
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lix3814
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Based in China, lix3814 has been an eBay member since Aug 07, 2015







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Nulook45

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Reply with quote  #2 
Same thing happened to Trijicon over there acog . 4x acog clone goes for 89 bucks fiber optic and all , Trijicon 4x acog  goes for about 1300. same with savage ,winchester ,and several others . 

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Nulook45

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Reply with quote  #3 
Alot of Gerber Knifes sold these days are made in china as well back in the 40s and 50s it was japan that made the cheap stuff . now its china where a weeks pay is pennies 
i quit buying alot of the chinese stuff because of this .
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combatshotgun

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Most of the knife companies have knives made there but they have a Quality Control person of theirs on site.   Much different then a Clone which is being made without sanctions.   Most often in another plant in another city in China by the exact same vendor making them under contract.  

Trump is trying to something about this but of course is being blocked at every turn.   The entire congress should be on board with this China trade deal to ensure we get a level playing field and stop getting rear ended by them.

Edited:  If you read this post before I edited I made a comment about travel there making it hard for our QC to visit other plants.  Gary correct me on that as he was there in that capacity and I my comment was wrong so I removed it. 



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David Armstrong

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Reply with quote  #5 
The bad thing about it is that some of the "clone" stuff is actually a fairly good buy for the price, but rather than trying to stand on their own these folks choose to be deceptive about it, which I find unacceptable.  
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combatshotgun

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Very true.  Reverse manufacturing a lot of this stuff is not "Rocket Science", however, when the buyer has an issue and sends it in to the company he thinks made it he is going to get a shock.   When it comes to the Surefire products the circuitry is far superior to the clones.   Look at the Surefire 2211 Wrist Lights and the MAP price of $149.  I can't sell it less then that.  The go to e-bay and see the what some believe is the same light for $16.99.   So anyone thinking he is getting a Surefire 2211 for less that price deserves what ever happens.

When the clone 618 series forends were being sent to Surefire for repair they simply sent them back to the buyer stating that is was not a Surefire Product.  They should have had their attorneys send letters telling the guy that it was an illegal clone and a patent infringement and was being confiscated.   Word would have got around fast on the internet and that great model might have been saved. 

I have two new in the box 318LM's I saved for future SBS builds but failed to save any 618's so if any of the 618's I have on other guns goes out they will send me a DSF that I don't want.

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Gary8907

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Reply with quote  #7 
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Armstrong
The bad thing about it is that some of the "clone" stuff is actually a fairly good buy for the price, but rather than trying to stand on their own these folks choose to be deceptive about it, which I find unacceptable.  


David,    I agree with you, and to that end I'd like to relate a story about something that happened in Guangzhou, which is a major Chinese manufacturing center, a few years ago. It was highly reported on CCTV (the main Chinese TV network) and in the Chinese press that a manufacturing company was found to be producing counterfeit Gucci handbags. The factory was raided, and shut down, by the Chinese police. When an inventory of the factory was conducted it was found that the machinery being used to produce the counterfeit bags was "state of the art" and superior to the equipment that Gucci was using, in its own factories, to produce their own bags, plus the materials being used by the Chinese "knockoff" factory were also as good as, or better than, the materials used by Gucci. When asked by reporters why the factory owner didn't produce his own bags, under his brand name, and compete with Gucci he couldn't come up with a viable answer, and just had a "deer in the headlights" look. In my decade+ time in China I've heard many such stories, but I think that the tide is changing. Lets not forget that the Chinese discovered iron smelting around 700BC, paper 100BC, gun powder 100AD, the compass 1,000AD and movable type printing about 1,000AD. After about 1000AD the Chinese seemed to have fallen off the discovery, and invention, phase and turned inward towards themselves. That introversion has dramatically changed in the last few decades, and if the Chinese can put an object on the "Dark Side of Moon" then, in my opinion, the USA had better start waking up and going back to the roots of the original founders, and leaders, of this great country. 
Sorry to high-jack the thread.
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David Armstrong

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Reply with quote  #8 
Not a hijack at all, Gary.  In fact it supports my point.  I had a similar thing with a scope.  Colt used to have a little 3 power scope with an integral mount to go on the carrying handle of the AR.  Mine got damaged in some training and when I tried to get a replacement found Colt no longer made them.  Did a little digging, found out Colt had never made them, they were made by a company in Japan.  So more digging and I found the Japanese version under their own brand name.  The difference?  Under the Colt name the scope was about $150, under the Japanese brand name the scope was about $70.  But AFAIK it was/is the same thing, and the "off-brand" scope has been doing a great job for close to 20 years now.
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